The Rivers of the Past were Higher – an Idiot’s Guide
Contents
- 1 Introduction
- 2 Ten Frequently Asked Questions
- 2.0.1 1. If the sea level was so high, wouldn’t people in the past have drowned?
- 2.0.2 2. If sea levels in the past were lower, how could rivers be higher?
- 2.0.3 3. Why aren’t all rivers and tributaries the same height in this area?
- 2.0.4 4. Is this hypothesis based on fact or just speculation?
- 2.0.5 5. I’ve walked these routes and found no water. How do you explain that?
- 2.0.6 6. Why would people push boats to the top of a hillfort?
- 2.0.7 7. Where is the evidence for larger rivers in the past?
- 2.0.8 8. I have a PhD in archaeology—why wasn’t I taught this?
- 2.0.9 9. Water can’t flow uphill, for the gradients are too high
- 2.0.10 10. How can you connect to other rivers as you need to go over the hill?
- 3 Conclusion
- 4 Exploring Prehistoric Britain: A Journey Through Time
- 5 Further Reading
- 6 Other Blogs
Introduction
A Revolutionary Perspective on Archaeology and Hydrology
Fifteen years ago, I introduced an idea that some might consider revolutionary—an insight born from my archaeological investigations. A clear pattern emerged through the detailed graphical analysis of 50 sites around Stonehenge and its surrounding barrows: these locations consistently occupied elevated positions within the upper 30th percentile of the landscape. (The Rivers of the Past were Higher)
This observation was more than coincidental. It pointed to a critical hydrological phenomenon: rivers during the post-glacial period were far more expansive than today. Surprisingly, this idea had not been explored within archaeological circles. I embarked on years of meticulous research to address this gap, culminating in a 50,000-word thesis titled “The Post-Glacial Flooding Hypothesis.” The thesis, supported by 125 peer-reviewed references, explored the interplay between mathematics, hydrology, and archaeology to propose a groundbreaking hypothesis: the elevated placement of ancient sites correlates with the past’s larger, more powerful rivers.
By analyzing major rivers, including the Thames and the Avon, I demonstrated that these waterways were shaped by the glacial meltwaters of the last ice age, and their ongoing diminution reflects millennia of hydrological evolution. This thesis challenged traditional archaeological assumptions about ancient landscapes and human settlement patterns. (The Rivers of the Past were Higher)
The Challenge of Being Heard
Despite publishing over 250 essays, producing over 100 videos, and fostering discussion among 5,000+ community members, I still encounter the same basic misconceptions and questions. Many of these queries could be answered with a brief engagement with the material—something even a curious six-year-old might accomplish if they took the time to delve beyond the surface.
This blog addresses the ten most common questions sceptics and enthusiasts pose. For those who have already grasped the fundamentals, feel free to move on. But I invite you to engage with the answers below for those who remain perplexed or unconvinced. Let’s unravel the science, revisit the evidence, and explore the transformative role of hydrology in reshaping our understanding of ancient human landscapes. (The Rivers of the Past were Higher)
Ten Frequently Asked Questions
1. If the sea level was so high, wouldn’t people in the past have drowned?
This question reflects a misunderstanding of hydrology. The elevation of a river is not directly linked to sea level. Rivers flow primarily from aquifers—water reservoirs embedded within bedrock—not from just rainfall as commonly taught in schools. These aquifers dictate water flow through natural springs, independent of sea level.
Unfortunately, even prominent figures in archaeology have misunderstood this principle. For instance, one well-known archaeologist dismissed my findings by dubbing the book the “Stonehenge on Sea” hypothesis – based solely on the book’s cover. This misinterpretation highlights the importance of engaging with the underlying science rather than relying on superficial impressions. (The Rivers of the Past were Higher)
2. If sea levels in the past were lower, how could rivers be higher?
During the last ice age, sea levels were approximately 65 meters lower than today. However, the colder climate meant precipitation fell as snow, forming massive glaciers. These glaciers trapped vast amounts of water, preventing it from flowing into rivers.
When the glaciers began to melt, the water released caused rivers to swell dramatically. This wasn’t a quick process. Recent models show that sea levels rose over 7,000 years after the initial melt, transforming landscapes like Doggerland—a land bridge connecting Britain to Europe—into the North Sea. This extended period of flooding explains how rivers could have been significantly larger in the past, despite lower sea levels.
3. Why aren’t all rivers and tributaries the same height in this area?
The simplistic notion that water “always seeks a common level” misrepresents the complexities of hydrology. Multiple aquifers at varying elevations feed rivers, and their flow mirrors the contours of the landscape. This intricate system ensures that rivers don’t conform to a uniform height.
For instance, rivers like the Thames have multiple sources that contribute to their flow. Even when rainfall is scarce, aquifers release water at different elevations, sustaining the river. This dynamic interplay explains why rivers don’t follow a universal level and why one river may sit higher than another in the same region.
4. Is this hypothesis based on fact or just speculation?
The hypothesis is firmly grounded in decades of research and fieldwork. It builds on three decades of academic study and exploration, culminating in an academic thesis supported by 125 peer-reviewed references.
5. I’ve walked these routes and found no water. How do you explain that?
Landscapes are dynamic, not static. Ten thousand years ago, the Sahara was a lush rainforest filled with elephants and lions. Similarly, Britain’s east coast was once a verdant plain connecting it to Europe. Over millennia, these landscapes changed dramatically due to shifting climates and sea levels.
Rivers that once flowed abundantly have since diminished as aquifers dried up. For example, the North Sea, Irish Sea, and English Channel gradually drained the rivers that fed them, lowering water tables and drying out springs in elevated areas. Today, you see a shadow of the ancient hydrological systems that once defined these regions.
6. Why would people push boats to the top of a hillfort?
The idea that ancient people moved boats uphill reflects a misunderstanding of how rivers once shaped the landscape. According to the hypothesis, ancient rivers like the Thames were vastly larger—potentially 3,000 times their current size. What we perceive as hills today would have appeared as islands within these expansive waterways.
Earthworks along these rivers likely defined the edges of these elevated landforms, making them accessible by boat. This perspective challenges modern assumptions about the topography of the past and highlights the transformative role of ancient hydrological systems.
7. Where is the evidence for larger rivers in the past?
British Geological Survey maps provide compelling evidence of ancient, larger rivers. These maps detail the extent of superficial deposits that mark the waterways’ historical boundaries. Features like river terraces further support this evidence.
For instance, the River Avon has ten terraces, indicating its past size and elevation. At one time, this river spanned tens of kilometres in width and was over 100 meters above current sea level. These geological features attest to the dynamic nature of rivers throughout history. (The Rivers of the Past were Higher)
8. I have a PhD in archaeology—why wasn’t I taught this?
Archaeological education has traditionally focused on specific methodologies while neglecting interdisciplinary approaches. In the 21st century, good archaeology requires integrating hydrology, dating methods, and advanced mapping techniques like LiDAR.
LiDAR, for instance, allows us to reconstruct ancient landscapes with remarkable precision. Yet, many archaeologists lack the training to interpret raw LiDAR data or understand its full potential. The absence of such knowledge limits their ability to engage with complex hypotheses like the one presented here. Archaeology must evolve into a more scientifically robust discipline to address this gap. (The Rivers of the Past were Higher)
9. Water can’t flow uphill, for the gradients are too high
This question reflects a common misconception about the nature and purpose of prehistoric linear earthworks, or “dykes,” in a flooded prehistoric landscape. Many people mistakenly interpret these structures through the lens of Victorian canals, imagining them as continuous waterways designed to transport goods over long distances in a single, uninterrupted flow. This comparison oversimplifies the engineering principles and functional realities of prehistoric dykes. (The Rivers of the Past were Higher)
In prehistory, river levels were significantly higher than today, which meant that the distances goods needed to travel over land were much shorter. Prehistoric dykes were not designed as continuous waterways; instead, they were engineered to serve as efficient connections between rivers or to transport raw materials from quarries to waterways. These materials could then be transported by boat to trading sites or processing locations.
A key feature of these dykes is their adaptability to the landscape. Unlike Victorian canals, which relied on a continuous channel of water and locks to maintain flow, prehistoric dykes often utilized natural springs at the tops of hills. These springs could provide water that flowed down both sides of a hill, enabling transport without the need to “go over” the hill itself. This ingenious use of natural water sources allowed for movement between points A and B most efficiently, considering the terrain and hydrology of the time. (The Rivers of the Past were Higher)
10. How can you connect to other rivers as you need to go over the hill?
In cases where goods or people needed to traverse a hill with water flowing down both sides, the solution was remarkably straightforward and practical. A boat or barge, naturally floating in the water and much lighter to manage than carrying goods or loads overland, could be dragged uphill using workforce or, more efficiently, animal power. Oxen, for example, would have been ideal for towing boats up gradients along the dyke.
Once the summit was reached, the natural downhill flow of water could take over, allowing the boat to continue its journey easily. Using animal power to drag boats uphill echoes practices seen in early Victorian canal systems. During this period, weirs were often constructed to slow water flow in downhill rivers, facilitating the towing of barges and boats uphill. The principle was straightforward: use animal power for uphill transport and natural flow for downhill movement, ensuring efficiency and minimizing the physical burden on workers.
This method would have effectively transported goods or people over varied terrain in a prehistoric context, leveraging both natural hydrology and available resources like animal labour. The adaptability of this system highlights the innovative and pragmatic approaches of ancient societies to overcome challenges posed by their environment.
By viewing prehistoric dykes through this lens, we can better appreciate their functionality and the ingenuity of those who designed them. Modern assumptions of continuous waterways did not limit these structures but reflected a deep understanding of the landscape and the tools available to navigate it. (The Rivers of the Past were Higher)
Conclusion
The Post-Glacial Flooding Hypothesis challenges conventional wisdom about ancient landscapes and hydrology. It invites us to reconsider the evidence and embrace a more interdisciplinary approach to archaeology. While the journey to broader acceptance has been fraught with resistance and misunderstanding, the evidence speaks for itself.
For those willing to engage deeply, the hypothesis offers a transformative lens to understand the past—a perspective rooted in science, shaped by rigorous research, and open to thoughtful debate.
Scientific progress begins with hypotheses. I welcome questions and challenges, but they must be substantiated with evidence. The burden of proof lies with those who disagree, requiring more than opinion; it demands well-referenced counterarguments. This process of scrutiny and debate is the essence of scientific advancement. (The Rivers of the Past were Higher)
(The Rivers of the Past were Higher)
Exploring Prehistoric Britain: A Journey Through Time
My blog delves into the fascinating mysteries of prehistoric Britain, challenging conventional narratives and offering fresh perspectives based on cutting-edge research, particularly using LiDAR technology. I invite you to explore some key areas of my research. For example, the Wansdyke, often cited as a defensive structure, is re-examined in light of new evidence. I’ve presented my findings in my blog post Wansdyke: A British Frontier Wall – ‘Debunked’, and a Wansdyke LiDAR Flyover video further visualizes my conclusions.
My work also often challenges established archaeological dogma. I argue that many sites, such as Hambledon Hill, commonly identified as Iron Age hillforts are not what they seem. My posts Lidar Investigation Hambledon Hill – NOT an ‘Iron Age Fort’ and Unmasking the “Iron Age Hillfort” Myth explore these ideas in detail and offer an alternative view. Similarly, sites like Cissbury Ring and White Sheet Camp, also receive a re-evaluation based on LiDAR analysis in my posts Lidar Investigation Cissbury Ring through time and Lidar Investigation White Sheet Camp, revealing fascinating insights into their true purpose. I have also examined South Cadbury Castle, often linked to the mythical Camelot56.
My research also extends to the topic of ancient water management, including the role of canals and other linear earthworks. I have discussed the true origins of Car Dyke in multiple posts including Car Dyke – ABC News PodCast and Lidar Investigation Car Dyke – North Section, suggesting a Mesolithic origin2357. I also explore the misidentification of Roman aqueducts, as seen in my posts on the Great Chesters (Roman) Aqueduct. My research has also been greatly informed by my post-glacial flooding hypothesis which has helped to inform the landscape transformations over time. I have discussed this hypothesis in several posts including AI now supports my Post-Glacial Flooding Hypothesis and Exploring Britain’s Flooded Past: A Personal Journey
Finally, my blog also investigates prehistoric burial practices, as seen in Prehistoric Burial Practices of Britain and explores the mystery of Pillow Mounds, often mistaken for medieval rabbit warrens, but with a potential link to Bronze Age cremation in my posts: Pillow Mounds: A Bronze Age Legacy of Cremation? and The Mystery of Pillow Mounds: Are They Really Medieval Rabbit Warrens?. My research also includes the astronomical insights of ancient sites, for example, in Rediscovering the Winter Solstice: The Original Winter Festival. I also review new information about the construction of Stonehenge in The Stonehenge Enigma.
(The Rivers of the Past were Higher)
Further Reading
For those interested in British Prehistory, visit www.prehistoric-britain.co.uk, a comprehensive resource featuring an extensive collection of archaeology articles, modern LiDAR investigations, and groundbreaking research. The site also includes insights and extracts from the acclaimed Robert John Langdon Trilogy, a series of books exploring Britain during the Prehistoric period. Titles in the trilogy include The Stonehenge Enigma, Dawn of the Lost Civilisation, and The Post Glacial Flooding Hypothesis, offering compelling evidence about ancient landscapes shaped by post-glacial flooding.
To further explore these topics, Robert John Langdon has developed a dedicated YouTube channel featuring over 100 video documentaries and investigations that complement the trilogy. Notable discoveries and studies showcased on the channel include 13 Things that Don’t Make Sense in History and the revelation of Silbury Avenue – The Lost Stone Avenue, a rediscovered prehistoric feature at Avebury, Wiltshire.
In addition to his main works, Langdon has released a series of shorter, accessible publications, ideal for readers delving into specific topics. These include:
- The Ancient Mariners
- Stonehenge Built 8300 BCE
- Old Sarum
- Prehistoric Rivers
- Dykes, Ditches, and Earthworks
- Echoes of Atlantis
- Homo Superior
- 13 Things that Don’t Make Sense in History
- Silbury Avenue – The Lost Stone Avenue
- Offa’s Dyke
- The Stonehenge Enigma
- The Post-Glacial Flooding Hypothesis
- The Stonehenge Hoax
- Dawn of the Lost Civilisation
- Darwin’s Children
- Great Chester’s Roman Aqueduct
- Wansdyke
For active discussions and updates on the trilogy’s findings and recent LiDAR investigations, join our vibrant community on Facebook. Engage with like-minded enthusiasts by leaving a message or contributing to debates in our Facebook Group.
Whether through the books, the website, or interactive videos, we aim to provide a deeper understanding of Britain’s fascinating prehistoric past. We encourage you to explore these resources and uncover the mysteries of ancient landscapes through the lens of modern archaeology.
For more information, including chapter extracts and related publications, visit the Robert John Langdon Author Page. Dive into works such as The Stonehenge Enigma or Dawn of the Lost Civilisation, and explore cutting-edge theories that challenge traditional historical narratives.
(The Rivers of the Past were Higher)
Other Blogs
1
a
- AI now Supports – Homo Superior
- AI now supports my Post-Glacial Flooding Hypothesis
- Alexander the Great sailed into India – where no rivers exist today
- Ancient Prehistoric Canals – The Vallum
- Ancient Secrets of Althorp – debunked
- Antler Picks built Ancient Monuments – yet there is no real evidence
- Antonine Wall – Prehistoric Canals (Dykes)
- Archaeological ‘pulp fiction’ – has archaeology turned from science?
- Archaeological Pseudoscience
- Archaeology in the Post-Truth Era
- Archaeology: A Bad Science?
- Are Raised Beaches Archaeological Pseudoscience?
- ATLANTIS: Discovery with Dan Snow Debunked
- Avebury Ditch – Avebury Phase 2
- Avebury Post-Glacial Flooding
- Avebury through time
- Avebury’s great mystery revealed
- Avebury’s Lost Stone Avenue – Flipbook
b
c
- Caerfai promontory fort – archaeological nonsense
- Car Dyke – ABC News PodCast
- Car Dyke – North Section
- CASE STUDY – An Inconvenient TRUTH (Craig Rhos Y Felin)
- Case Study – River Avon
- Case Study – Woodhenge Reconstruction
- Chapter 2 – Craig Rhos-Y-Felin Debunked
- Chapter 2 – Stonehenge Phase I
- Chapter 2 – Variation of the Species
- Chapter 3 – Post Glacial Sea Levels
- Chapter 3 – Stonehenge Phase II
- Chapter 7 – Britain’s Post-Glacial Flooding
- Cissbury Ring through time
d
- Darwin’s Children – Flipbook
- Darwin’s Children – The Cro-Magnons
- Dawn of the Lost Civilisation – Flipbook
- Dawn of the Lost Civilisation – Introduction
- Digging for Britain – Cerne Abbas 1 of 2
- Digging for Britain Debunked – Cerne Abbas 2
- Digging Up Britain’s Past – Debunked
- DLC Chapter 1 – The Ascent of Man
- Durrington Walls – Woodhenge through time
- Dyke Construction – Hydrology 101
- Dykes Ditches and Earthworks
- DYKES of Britain
e
g
h
- Hadrian’s Wall – Military Way Hoax
- Hadrian’s Wall – the Stanegate Hoax
- Hadrian’s Wall LiDAR investigation
- Hambledon Hill – NOT an ‘Iron Age Fort’
- Hayling Island Lidar Maps
- Historic River Avon
- Hollingsbury Camp Brighton
- Hollows, Sunken Lanes and Palaeochannels
- Homo Superior – Flipbook
- Homo Superior – History’s Giants
- How Lidar will change Archaeology
l
m
- Maiden Castle through time
- Maritime Diffusion Model for Megaliths in Europe: A Groundbreaking Study
- Mathematics Meets Archaeology: Discovering the Mesolithic Origins of Car Dyke
- Mesolithic River Avon
- Mesolithic Stonehenge
- Minerals found in Prehistoric and Roman Quarries
- Mining in the Prehistoric to Roman Period
- Mount Caburn through time
- Mysteries of the Oldest Boatyard Uncovered
- Mythological Dragons – a non-existent animal that is shared by the World.
o
p
- Pillow Mounds: A Bronze Age Legacy of Cremation?
- Post Glacial Flooding – Flipbook
- Prehistoric Burial Practices of Britain
- Prehistoric Canals – The Vallum
- Prehistoric Canals – Wansdyke
- Prehistoric Canals – Wansdyke
- Prehistoric Canals (Dykes) – Great Chesters Aqueduct (The Vallum Pt. 4)
- Prehistoric Canals (Dykes) – Hadrian’s Wall Vallum (pt 1)
- Prehistoric Canals (Dykes) – Maiden Way
- Prehistoric Canals (Dykes) – Offa’s Dyke (Chepstow)
- Prehistoric Canals (Dykes) – Offa’s Dyke (LiDAR Survey)
- Prehistoric Canals (Dykes) – Offa’s Dyke Survey (End of Section A)
- Prehistoric Canals (Dykes) – Roman Military Way
- Prehistoric Canals (Dykes) – Wansdyke (4)
- Prehistoric Canals Wansdyke 2
- Professor Bonkers and the mad, mad World of Archaeology
r
s
- Sea Level Changes
- Section A – NY26SW
- Section B – NY25NE & NY26SE
- Section C – NY35NW
- Section D – NY35NE
- Section E – NY46SW & NY45NW
- Section F – NY46SE & NY45NE
- Section G – NY56SW
- Section H – NY56NE & NY56SE
- Section I – NY66NW
- Section J – NY66NE
- Section K – NY76NW
- Section L – NY76NE
- Section M – NY87SW & NY86NW
- Section N – NY87SE
- Section O – NY97SW & NY96NW
- Section P – NY96NE
- Section Q – NZ06NW
- Section R – NZ06NE
- Section S – NZ16NW
- Section T – NZ16NE
- Section U – NZ26NW & NZ26SW
- Section V – NZ26NE & NZ26SE
- Silbury Avenue – Avebury’s First Stone Avenue
- Silbury Hill
- Silbury Hill / Sanctuary – Avebury Phase 3
- Six years ago archaeology made an astonishing discovery (Einkorn Wheat)
- Somerset Plain – Signs of Post-Glacial Flooding
- South Cadbury Castle – Camelot
- Statonbury Camp near Bath – an example of West Wansdyke
- Stone me – the druids are looking the wrong way on Solstice day
- Stone Money – Credit System
- Stone Transportation and Dumb Censorship
- Stonehenge – Monument to the Dead
- Stonehenge Hoax – Dating the Monument
- Stonehenge Hoax – Round Monument?
- Stonehenge Hoax – Summer Solstice
- Stonehenge LiDAR tour
- Stonehenge Phase I (The Stonehenge Landscape)
- Stonehenge Solved – Pythagorean maths put to use four thousand years before he was born
- Stonehenge Stone Transportation
- Stonehenge Through Time
- Stonehenge, Doggerland and Atlantis connection
- Stonehenge: Discovery with Dan Snow Debunked
- Stonehenge’s Location -The Stonehenge Hoax
- Stonehenge’s The Lost Circle Revealed – DEBUNKED
t
- Ten thousand year old boats found on Northern Europe’s Hillsides
- Ten thousand-year-old boats found on Northern Europe’s Hillsides
- The Ancient Mariners – Flipbook
- The Ancient Mariners – Prehistoric seafarers of the Mesolithic
- The Bluestone Enigma
- The Dolmen and Long Barrow Connection
- The Durrington Walls Hoax – it’s not a henge?
- The First European Smelted Bronzes
- The Fury of the Past: Natural Disasters in Historical and Prehistoric Britain
- The Giant’s Graves of Cumbria
- The Giants of Prehistory: Cro-Magnon and the Ancient Monuments
- The Great Antler Pick Hoax
- The Great Chichester Hoax – A Bridge too far?
- The Great Dorchester Aqueduct Hoax
- The Great Hadrian’s Wall Hoax
- The Great Iron Age Hill Fort Hoax
- The Great Offa’s Dyke Hoax
- The Great Prehistoric Migration Hoax
- The Great Stone Transportation Hoax
- The Great Stonehenge Hoax
- The Great Wansdyke Hoax
- The Henge and River Relationship
- The Logistical Impossibility of Defending Maiden Castle
- The Long Barrow Mystery
- The Long Barrow Mystery: Unraveling Ancient Connections
- The Lost Island of Avalon – revealed
- The Maths – LGM total ice volume
- The Mystery of Pillow Mounds: Are They Really Medieval Rabbit Warrens?
- The Old Sarum Hoax
- The Oldest Boat Yard in the World found in Wales
- The Post-Glacial Flooding Hypothesis – Flipbook
- The Post-Glacial Flooding Theory
- The Problem with Hadrian’s Vallum
- The Rise of the Cro-Magnon (Homo Superior)
- The Rivers of the Past were Higher – an Idiot’s Guide
- The Silbury Hill Lighthouse?
- The Stonehenge Avenue
- The Stonehenge Avenue
- The Stonehenge Code: Unveiling its 10,000-Year-Old Secret
- The Stonehenge Enigma – Flipbook
- The Stonehenge Enigma: What Lies Beneath? – Debunked
- The Stonehenge Hoax – Bluestone Quarry Site
- The Stonehenge Hoax – Flipbook
- The Stonehenge Hoax – Moving the Bluestones
- The Stonehenge Hoax – Periglacial Stripes
- The Stonehenge Hoax – Station Stones
- The Stonehenge Hoax – The Ditch
- The Stonehenge Hoax – The Slaughter Stone
- The Stonehenge Hoax – The Stonehenge Layer
- The Stonehenge Hoax – Totem Poles
- The Stonehenge Hoax – Woodhenge
- The Stonehenge Hospital
- The Troy, Hyperborea and Atlantis Connection
- The Vallum @ Hadrian’s Wall – it’s Prehistoric!
- The Woodhenge Hoax
- Three Dykes – Kidland Forest
- Top Ten misidentified Fire Beacons in British History
- Troy Debunked
- TSE – DVD Barrows
- TSE DVD – An Inconvenient Truth
- TSE DVD – Antler Picks
- TSE DVD – Avebury
- TSE DVD – Durrington Walls & Woodhenge
- TSE DVD – Dykes
- TSE DVD – Epilogue
- TSE DVD – Stonehenge Phase I
- TSE DVD – Stonehenge Phase II
- TSE DVD – The Post-Glacial Hypothesis
- TSE DVD Introduction
- TSE DVD Old Sarum
w
- Wansdyke – Short Film
- Wansdyke East – Prehistoric Canals
- Wansdyke Flipbook
- Wansdyke LiDAR Flyover
- Wansdyke: A British Frontier Wall – ‘Debunked’
- Was Columbus the first European to reach America?
- White Sheet Camp
- Why a Simple Fence Beats a Massive Dyke (and What That Means for History)
- Windmill Hill – Avebury Phase 1
- Winter Solstice – Science, Propaganda and Indoctrination
- Woodhenge – the World’s First Lighthouse?
(The Rivers of the Past were Higher)
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